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Post by aussie on Mar 8, 2009 9:04:55 GMT
It`s a blanket rule for all clubs that must be adheared to or the F.A. can fine the club and bring in sanctions against the club for ignoring F.A. stipulations. We have no choice in the matter! Also good morning Dave!
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Post by khilllegend on Mar 8, 2009 9:06:52 GMT
like i said earlier i felt threatened and belittled why not just say 'excuse me' not just grab me by the wrist whilst walking past and threaten to evict me from the ground  And as for stewards picking up on the lids and seeing them i went past 4 in the family stand,2 in the grandstand as i went to see darryl in the press office, back through the family stand and then let into the popside by 2 stewards and walk straight past 6 others to take my place at the end of the popside! Surely after walking past 14 or so stewards that didn't see it clearly in my hand they were not very observent Then was approached in the popside in the 20th min of the game or so was rather embarrasing shall we say and the people next to me were shouting at them too! It was very embarrrasing to be told in front of a load of people and not asked to remove it by the 14 odd stewards i went past to get to the popside! |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Mar 8, 2009 9:12:11 GMT
khilllegend I fully understand who you felt and I too have been angry and upset about this bottle top rule,we have Steve on here now who does care and wants to make the ground a better and happier place for all of us and will take on board what we say and will look to get answers for us. At the end of the day he and all the other stewards will still have to carry out the duties the club requires them to and it then may be the case that we will need to take the matter directly to the club.
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Post by khilllegend on Mar 8, 2009 9:23:14 GMT
khilllegend I fully understand who you felt and I too have been angry and upset about this bottle top rule,we have Steve on here now who does care and wants to make the ground a better and happier place for all of us and will take on board what we say and will look to get answers for us. At the end of the day he and all the other stewards will still have to carry out the duties the club requires them to and it then may be the case that we will need to take the matter directly to the club. lol i didn't feel anybody!  |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Mar 8, 2009 9:58:19 GMT
I have just had a chat with Ant (TUAFC1)who you may know is on the Council of the Devon FA. He is unsure if the bottle top rule is in fact an FA rule and will now find out and report back to us.
As Ant said, if it was an FA rule it would have to apply to all enclosed football grounds that charge an entry fee. This at more local level would include clubs like Dawlish and even down to clubs like Newton Spurs level and I know that you do not have bottle tops removed at those grounds. He also points out that just because the rule is written on a board at the ground, does not mean that it is an FA rule. When he finds out I will post back on this thread and make contact with the club it it is not an FA rule.
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AR10
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Post by AR10 on Mar 8, 2009 10:07:51 GMT
www.torquayunited.com/page/Charter/0,,10445,00.html This is the FA & Football league ground regulations set out on our own club website, this is the standard rules for all league grounds, no mention of bottle tops anywhere.
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AR10
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Post by AR10 on Mar 8, 2009 10:25:43 GMT
Here's a theory to try, You are not just being sold the drink but also it's bottle complete with lid that it goes in, therefore they have no legal right to take any part of that back from you after you have purchased the said product. As soon as they keep the lid I would ask for your money back as they can then not reseal the lid & resell that bottle & you would be entitled to a refund as the drink has not been sold to you as seen. The only way around this from a club point of view is to serve everything on tap & serve in cardboard cups with plastic lid & a straw.
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rjdgull
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Post by rjdgull on Mar 8, 2009 11:09:18 GMT
Ah, but one of the contract terms is the exclusion of said top, once you paid your money you have agreed to those terms and contract completed - unless you can renegotiate the terms between your offer and payment! Unlikely unless you are khillegend!! (Some smart solicitor will probably now correct me otherwise  ) |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Mar 8, 2009 11:46:14 GMT
rjdgull, can you tell me where and when anyone has made that agreement? yes we all know the club seems to have taken it upon itself to make this a rule, but what about anyone who has never been to a game before. Is there some sign that states that before you buy a drink that you agree to having the top removed. If not then it has not been made a condition of the sale of said bottle and therefore I think you would be fully entitled to ask for a refund.
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Post by khilllegend on Mar 8, 2009 11:48:11 GMT
Ah, but one of the contract terms is the exclusion of said top, once you paid your money you have agreed to those terms and contract completed - unless you can renegotiate the terms between your offer and payment! Unlikely unless you are khillegend!! (Some smart solicitor will probably now correct me otherwise ) lol haha just to rest this i bought the drink from home and didnt buy it at the ground it was a bottle of oasis for harry to drink as it has a wide neck! and the funny thing is too the stupid actually said that harry would put coins in the lid as a weapon to throw on the pitch. Because of his condition if he threw forward it would end up going backwards! |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Mar 8, 2009 12:25:49 GMT
I know many people who bring a drink from home, If only because of the price charged inside the ground. I would have thought that if it was a condition of entry into the ground that you agreed to surrender any bottle tops, that it should clearly be stated on the outside of any turnstile and before any entrance money was collected from you. You can't take peoples money and then lay down the rules once you have it and have them inside the ground. Well thats my view anyway  |
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rjdgull
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Post by rjdgull on Mar 8, 2009 12:48:57 GMT
Dave, As I see it, you make an offer by asking for bottle of x. The bottle is placed on the counter and the top removed -ie. the good is displayed. You accept it in this state by paying the money - contracts exchanged! The display of shop items is known as "an offer to treat" and is what your offer is based on - I suppose it should be made clear that the bottle top is not included beforehand - not sure what impact this could have if it isn't and if storage in the drinks cabinet in a staff only area counts as being on display  Khillegend - I was just using you as an example that there are exceptions to any rule and potentially the terms of the contract could be renegotiated to include the bottle top  |
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Post by khilllegend on Mar 8, 2009 13:03:27 GMT
they moan about bottle lids but yesterday they told me next time to take a cup for harry and a bottle without a lid on, which i view as an even bigger item to throw on the pitch and be filled to the brim with coins  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2009 13:55:43 GMT
TUAFC1
Someone needs to look at this board that lists the rules so we can find out what the exact wording is. My guess is that bottled drinks complete with lids are allowed in the ground,after all the club stores these drinks on it's premises with the lids firmly on.
What you are probably not allowed to do is to take bottle lids into the spectating areas (i.e onto the terraces such as the Pop side) Therefore if you want to insist you are the rightful owner of the bottle top as you have paid for it that is fine..you can keep it as long as you don't attempt to take it with you onto the terraces. We should also remember that chip wrappers, pie cartons etc are therefore soley our property once we have bought them & so we shouldn't drop them on the terraces ( at least put them in a bin otherwise the Club might insist we take all our property with us when we leave their premises).
Dave wonders whether a 'no bottle tops' sign should be displayed outside the ground so that people are aware of the rule before they enter. On that basis we'd have 'no smoking' signs , 'no photography' signs, 'no c word chants' etc etc plastering the outside of Plainmoor reminding us of all the things we used to be allowed to do but are now forbidden.
It won't be long before supporters have to pass a 'Football Spectators NVQ' to make sure only those fans with sufficient knowledge of all the things they're not allowed to do are given entry to the ground.
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merse
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Post by merse on Mar 8, 2009 14:34:28 GMT
We should also remember that chip wrappers, pie cartons etc are therefore soley our property once we have bought them & so we shouldn't drop them on the terraces ( at least put them in a bin otherwise the Club might insist we take all our property with us when we leave their premises).  I've always reckoned that what defines a "proper" non league ground is the proliferation of litter bins that most of them have....................why even AFC Wimbledon's mascot carted one round with him at our game there last season and got most upset when I went up to him, opened the lid and used it to throw my empty Bovril cup in.  Obviously WE still have pretensions of grandeur owing to the conspicuous lack of such receptacles at Plainmoor! |
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