merse
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Post by merse on May 31, 2010 7:19:04 GMT
I am now used to Chez Stepho.........................
Since then, I think it's become fairly obvious I am more of a Home Counties man than a Londoner, and I know Merse will take the pee out of me for that  I'm not going to take the pee for that, I've known you and he live in Walthamstow, Chislehurst and now Shepperton ~ Home Counties the latter two ~ nice areas, and you and Rigsby move up in the world each time you acquire another property......................or have you had to dispose of one along the way? Before you know it, you'll be living in one of those Esher gaffs adjoining Sandown Park and then you'll be able to have a lay in until one o'clock and still be in time for the first race. Mind you, Kempton's only a 20 minute stroll away from you now isn't it? |
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Post by capitalgull on May 31, 2010 8:08:45 GMT
I never lowered myself to living in the Stow, just visiting when I fancied a trip to the Greyhounds! I lowered myself as far as Eltham and that was bad enough...
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Post by lambethgull on May 31, 2010 21:57:48 GMT
I can't really judge the market on the strength of two visits in a year but the market seemed a lot busier than it did a year or so ago. There seems to be more stores but as you say if they sell out the market to the "Farmers Market" types then you'll see more of the Guardian Reader types. But I quite like it. It's not packed with tourists and it isn't a rip off. To be fair, it's the input and patronage of these types that has led to the ressurgance of places like Broadway Market...and not just there either, but places like Exmouth Market, Whitecross Street Market, the food Market at Portobello, and Borough Market (a haven for tourists, japanese tourists and twerps willing to shell out £3 for a loaf, but still a fabulous setting and one of London's most historic markets) to name just a few examples. In an ideal world, we'd still be able to visit the fruit and veg market in Covent Garden (relocated south of the river to Battersea in the 1970s), get our fish from Old Billingsgate, the wonderful 19th century fascade of which survives on the waterfront of the north bank, an altogether different and enjoyable walk incidentally, than the one to be found on the opposite bank (though the division between commerce/business on the north bank and leisure and entertainment found on the opposite side of the river is as stark now as it would have been four centuries ago). In this respect, Smithfield Market, which Merse has already mentioned, really is a special place. This area itself is as drenched in history and blood as the boards and tables of the market still are with blood and flesh for the wholesale market. The sight of the porters and butchers going about their business in their trademark white overalls is something to behold, and in this most atmospheric and historic part of London, it is not at all difficult to imagine what the rest of London's great markets were like in their pomp at their old locations. The fact is though that many Londoners, just like the majority of people elsewhere, opt to purchase their food from the supermarket. Whilst a few of London's markets - Brixton Market springs to mind in this respect - survive as places where people can still buy a majority of the food they need at affordable prices, the majority of London's food markets are places which provide small businesses with opportunities to sell their wares; products which are usually of a higher quality - and price - than that found in the local Tescos. |
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merse
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Post by merse on Jun 1, 2010 13:25:57 GMT
The fact is though that many Londoners, just like the majority of people elsewhere, opt to purchase their food from the supermarket. Whilst a few of London's markets - Brixton Market springs to mind in this respect - survive as places where people can still buy a majority of the food they need at affordable prices, the majority of London's food markets are places which provide small businesses with opportunities to sell their wares; products which are usually of a higher quality - and price - than that found in the local Tescos. Where the wholesale markets like New Spitalfields, Nine Elms, Billingsgate and Smithfield score is that they enjoy a good patronage from the ethnically diverse Londoners who aren't afraid to get up early and take advantage of the rock bottom prices to be had at "end of trading".Hence there are integrated "retail" traders and indeed wholesalers themselves from whom you can buy your particular needs at a fraction of "Tesco Prices" ~ but if you're not prepared to shop in the early hours you've had it, as they are all finished by 8 or 9am. Last Christmas I got a massive free range turkey at Smithfield for £11, and used to regularly get legs of lamb, shoulders, and other cuts for a fraction of supermarket cost, and certainly a hell of a lot cheaper than the local quality butcher. A lot of the spices and African root veg and greens; to say nothing of the exotic fish that we use at home, are freely available near us in Stroud Green Road, N4 or if not Bijou goes to either Ridley Road E8 in Dalston or West Green Road N15 in Tottenham for her supplies; and if we lived over the water it would be sure to be Brixton Market. When you've sat down to a Christmas Dinner of a grinning cat fish sat in the middle of the dining table in all it's glory you realise that you're unlikely to find one of those at Tescos. From her years in Paris, Bijou wouldn't dream of buying any more bread than is needed for breakfast, hot and straight out of the bakery; so that she then has to buy again in the late morning for lunchtime freshness ~ none of that crappy mass produced stodge for us! I know people who travel in miles from the Home Counties and suburbs to shop at places like this.......................people (or the sons and daughters of people) who lived on the doorsteps of these markets when they first arrived as first generation immigrants and who just cannot accept the blandness and lack of choice in their local Budgens or Sainsbury. I think places like Borough Market have become a bit of a fraud, ripping off the tourist and "twerps" as you call them Lambeth................people who pay stupid prices for stuff that can be sourced far more cheaply in the poorer areas of London. Take a walk round Dalston, Stoke Newington and Green Lanes for a real taste of Turkey, sit down with them for an early morning feast that resembles a hot spicey stew mopped up with their speciality bread in eateries that stay open rigt through the night to be ready for the early hours arrivals. Somehow after that your bowl of Cornflakes will never again suffice to start a winter's day. Mind you, my summertime favourite is to breakfast at one of the Algerian or Moroccan cafes just down the road from me in the Seven Sisters Road; enjoying a strong North African coffee and pastry in the sunshine! |
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Rags
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Post by Rags on Jun 1, 2010 14:17:42 GMT
From her years in Paris, Bijou wouldn't dream of buying any more bread than is needed for breakfast, hot and straight out of the bakery; so that she then has to buy again in the late morning for lunchtime freshness ~ none of that crappy mass produced stodge for us! We bake our own and we don't need a bread machine to do it in. Maybe 5 mins to put it together, an hour to rise and 40+5 mins in the oven. Wholemeal doesn't need kneading, either. We haven't bought a loaf of bread for over a year since we discovered the simplicity of home-baking. Of course, due to lack of E-numbers and other preservatives it only lasts for four days at a push, but we can freeze half a loaf if we don't think we're going to eat it all. Maybe not as good as fresh from the bakery every day, but a lot better than supermarket stuff. Other methods include digging a large pit and putting the hot ash from your camp fire into it. Wrap the dough in foil and drop into the pit. Cover it all up with earth and wait until morning... ;D |
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merse
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Post by merse on Jun 1, 2010 17:00:51 GMT
Other methods include digging a large pit and putting the hot ash from your camp fire into it. Wrap the dough in foil and drop into the pit. Cover it all up with earth and wait until morning... If we did that in our third floor flat, the woman underneath would declare Holy War. It was bad enough when she came knocking about water penetrating through her ceiling I attracted her attention to the state of OUR ceiling and then she realised we were BOTH getting flooded by 'er Upstairs! |
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Post by lambethgull on Jun 2, 2010 21:30:32 GMT
Last Christmas I got a massive free range turkey at Smithfield for £11, and used to regularly get legs of lamb, shoulders, and other cuts for a fraction of supermarket cost, and certainly a hell of a lot cheaper than the local quality butcher. A lot of the spices and African root veg and greens; to say nothing of the exotic fish that we use at home, are freely available near us in Stroud Green Road, N4 or if not Bijou goes to either Ridley Road E8 in Dalston or West Green Road N15 in Tottenham for her supplies; and if we lived over the water it would be sure to be Brixton Market. When you've sat down to a Christmas Dinner of a grinning cat fish sat in the middle of the dining table in all it's glory you realise that you're unlikely to find one of those at Tescos. I'll have to check some of those places out, Merse, though I am firmly in tourist mode when heading that far north. I'll also have to set my alarm for an early start one day in December for a Smithfield turkey. A breakfast pint in The Cock Tavern underneath the market should make the trip worthwhile anyway, even if the denizens of north London have cleared the place out of turkeys  Any cretin bemoaning the influx of immigrants to our country, and in particular London, would do well to visit some of the capital's day markets and sample the colour, smells and variety of their foodstuffs. My diet would certainly be a tedious, mundane affair without their influence and imports that's for sure. The African stalls on Broadway Market (sold at Farmer's Market's prices unfortunately...at least to this rare visitor) are worth the trip alone. Just the thing before a couple of glasses of Belgian beer in the Dove before heading off, either down the Regent's Canal for a walk, or the bus back into town. |
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Post by chrish on Jun 3, 2010 20:49:17 GMT
I can't really judge the market on the strength of two visits in a year but the market seemed a lot busier than it did a year or so ago. There seems to be more stores but as you say if they sell out the market to the "Farmers Market" types then you'll see more of the Guardian Reader types. But I quite like it. It's not packed with tourists and it isn't a rip off. To be fair, it's the input and patronage of these types that has led to the ressurgance of places like Broadway Market...and not just there either, but places like Exmouth Market, Whitecross Street Market, the food Market at Portobello, and Borough Market (a haven for tourists, japanese tourists and twerps willing to shell out £3 for a loaf, but still a fabulous setting and one of London's most historic markets) to name just a few examples. In an ideal world, we'd still be able to visit the fruit and veg market in Covent Garden (relocated south of the river to Battersea in the 1970s), get our fish from Old Billingsgate, the wonderful 19th century fascade of which survives on the waterfront of the north bank, an altogether different and enjoyable walk incidentally, than the one to be found on the opposite bank (though the division between commerce/business on the north bank and leisure and entertainment found on the opposite side of the river is as stark now as it would have been four centuries ago). In this respect, Smithfield Market, which Merse has already mentioned, really is a special place. This area itself is as drenched in history and blood as the boards and tables of the market still are with blood and flesh for the wholesale market. The sight of the porters and butchers going about their business in their trademark white overalls is something to behold, and in this most atmospheric and historic part of London, it is not at all difficult to imagine what the rest of London's great markets were like in their pomp at their old locations. The fact is though that many Londoners, just like the majority of people elsewhere, opt to purchase their food from the supermarket. Whilst a few of London's markets - Brixton Market springs to mind in this respect - survive as places where people can still buy a majority of the food they need at affordable prices, the majority of London's food markets are places which provide small businesses with opportunities to sell their wares; products which are usually of a higher quality - and price - than that found in the local Tescos. Yes, that's true enough. What I don't want to see is little Organic Middle Class Kingdoms of Sanctimony in pockets of London where they never usually venture. I remember how the area around Notting Hill Gate looked like back in 1999-2000. The older pubs all got gutted. The Prince Albert turned from a decent boozer with a very nice mix of people into a souless Gastropub complete with a divvy in a Bandana "cooking" bacon ciabattas in an open kitchen, a bouncer on the door to keep the locals out and a clientele of posh sods who shouted inanely at each other over the generic jazz/dub muzak. The Devonshire Arms got turned into a Chic bar which then folded and now it's a Foxtons Estate Agents. The Warwick Castle on Portbello Road, which was a bit dodgy, had the Prince Albert treatment. All because of Hugh fecking Grant and Julia sodding Roberts. I think it's best to avoid Covent Garden, Spitalfields and Borough (even though it's in a fantastic setting) as they are just tourist traps. Without sounding too much like that pompous old prat Rick Stein I really think that the French get their markets just right. They are just used as places selling local produce at decent prices to the local population. The attraction is the market itself rather than having to sell retro clothes or bags made out of Onion sacks. They've just about got it right at Hackney at the moment. Cheers for the tips about the other markets Merse. |
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merse
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Post by merse on Jun 3, 2010 23:02:31 GMT
Cheers for the tips about the other markets Merse. You're welcome, but I would point out that both Stroud Green Road and West Green Road are streets, rather than markets and thankfully streets where the liklihood of seeing "Dave" (Cameron), "Gideon" (Osborne) and that loony BoJo holding a Bullingdon Club get together as you would in Notting Hill are absolutely zilch in Norths 4 and 15..................they'd fecking shite themselves at the very thought of entering those post codes. Whilst W11 was always poncy, W10's demise as an eclectic mix of Rastafariasm, South American mixed culture and downright working class grittiness has seen it become a (slightly) cheaper enclave of the Henry's and Carolines who weekend in the Cotswolds or indeed in Rick Steinville (Padstow) now that they can fly down to Newquay because it's "far too tiring to drive dahling"The roads off Stroud Green Road tell a story.......................if you walk up Northwards, to the left you have the slightly "edgy" area where I live and to the right it's all a bit Yuppie ~ the types who are in their first ludicrously overpriced terraced house or flat and who will migrate northwards to Crouch Hill or Muswell Hill as soon as they secure a promotion at work. There are two pubs amonst the many around here I would recommend to you.................... The Faltering Fullback in Perth Road just to the East of Stroud Green Road is a tiny little boozer on the apex of a triangle where I'll often pop in for a swift 'un when I'm pushing Calvin back in his stroller from Finsbury Park, no doubt it's full of those Yuppies in the evenings, but during a midweek lunchtime there's often only me and a couple of other old gits for company. The other one's The Dairy at the bottom of Crouch Hill where Hanley Road cuts off from the top of Stroud Green Road and for a hungry young single guy like you Chris, the Sunday Roast is ample and good to eat! I'd no more go into a pub around Tottenham than volunteer for euthanasia, so I don't go pubbing around the West Green Road manor, but Bijou knows loads of Congolese "shabeens" where you would feel decidedly under dressed, under blinged and under scrutiny even if you wore your best Thierry Mugliere suite and eighteen carat bling amongst the canary yellow/lime gree/scarlet suited and matching bowler hatted young guns from Kinshasa (well alright, Edmonton then) and your eyes would be out on their stalks at the immaculate women they have on their arms.  Whilst our beloved and cycling freak Mayor is often seen on the streets between Highbury Corner and all points south, I think he'd suffer a nose bleed if his pedalling took him any further out from trendy Barnsbury and Highbury Fields into the badlands where the kids still walk to school and they have Job Centres. I'd love to see Boris in his bicycle clips and helmet stumble into that lot in Tottenham!  |
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Post by lambethgull on Jun 6, 2010 18:06:33 GMT
Yes, that's true enough. What I don't want to see is little Organic Middle Class Kingdoms of Sanctimony in pockets of London where they never usually venture. I remember how the area around Notting Hill Gate looked like back in 1999-2000. The older pubs all got gutted. The Prince Albert turned from a decent boozer with a very nice mix of people into a souless Gastropub complete with a divvy in a Bandana "cooking" bacon ciabattas in an open kitchen, a bouncer on the door to keep the locals out and a clientele of posh sods who shouted inanely at each other over the generic jazz/dub muzak. The Devonshire Arms got turned into a Chic bar which then folded and now it's a Foxtons Estate Agents. The Warwick Castle on Portbello Road, which was a bit dodgy, had the Prince Albert treatment. All because of Hugh fecking Grant and Julia sodding Roberts. I think it's best to avoid Covent Garden, Spitalfields and Borough (even though it's in a fantastic setting) as they are just tourist traps.Without sounding too much like that pompous old prat Rick Stein I really think that the French get their markets just right. They are just used as places selling local produce at decent prices to the local population. The attraction is the market itself rather than having to sell retro clothes or bags made out of Onion sacks. They've just about got it right at Hackney at the moment. Cheers for the tips about the other markets Merse. I wouldn't touch Covent Garden with a barge pole, crammed as it is with its unappealing mix of naive day-trippers and packs of 20-something Australians and off-duty City types 'amusing' everyone within earshot with their idiotic 'banter' and pi**ing contests. And although there is much to admire in Spitalfields from an architectural and historical point of view, the 'market' is no longer a proper market at all, and the atmospheric surrounding streets - including most of the southern end of Brick Lane - have to a large extent sold out to city law firms and pseudo-bohemian 'boutiques' serving skinny-jeaned prats from Shoreditch. I will put a word in for Borough however. Whilst the whole of the South Bank (from Westminster to Bridge to Tower Bridge) is littered with places whose sole function is to parts fools from their money, including large chunks of Borough Market, there is more to Borough than that. Southwark Cathedral is an absolute gem and several of the pubs are worth visiting too: The Old Kings Head (just avoid when Millwall are at home), The George (anyone with an appreciation Borough's Chaucerian connections will enjoy the layout, architecture and location of this place - although the beer is Green King) and near Borough tube station itself, the Royal Oak (London's only Harvey's tied house) to name three examples. As for your point about what estate agents call 'gentrification', I agree. Whilst it might be argued that the ghettoisation/forcing out of an existing population for a more affluent one is a process that has happened in London ever since it has existed, it certainly isn't something that should be encouraged...or smirked about over a £4 bottle of Peroni beer and wasabi peas for that matter  . |
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merse
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Post by merse on Jun 6, 2010 19:40:47 GMT
The Old Kings Head (just avoid when Millwall are at home), The George (anyone with an appreciation Borough's Chaucerian connections will enjoy the layout, architecture and location of this place - although the beer is Green King) and near Borough tube station itself, the Royal Oak (London's only Harvey's tied house) to name three examples. Aaaahhh Harveys, now there's a quality real ale! Capitalgull will was lyrical about their brewery in Lewes and whenever we were on the road to and from racing at places like Plumpton, Fontwell Park or Goodwood we would be on the look out for a Harveys House. Heads would turn when he and I walked into some of these establishments, me in my panama hat and linen suite; he in his best frock and high heels  The only problem came when he wanted to use the toilet.................why did we cavort around like that. Well wouldn't you to grab a chance to win The Most Glamourous Couple At The Races award? The worst thing I ever did was tempt him away from his penchant for Pimms, his supping of pints of foaming Harveys amongst all the beautiful people was always a dead giveaway.  |
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