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Post by Swanny on Feb 22, 2014 18:08:40 GMT
Another pathetic home display in a game we again looked incapable of scoring. The writing must surely be on the wall now and we are now heading towards the Conference. It would be something if there was a glimmer of hope but it seems we are going down in a whimper. I did not think things could get any worse after Knill left but sadly I now think they are. What annoys me more than anything is the constant reliance on untried loan strikers. Wilkinson today clearly was not the answer, O'Brien came on late and looked awful as well. Hawley tried as usual and got stuck in but never looks like scoring. Ladbadie had our best 2 chances today - his 2 strong headers from corners were cleared off the line. Ladbadie also appeared to get tripped in the penalty area but ended up getting booked for diving. Now he is suspended for 2 games.
Crowd was 2,218, 70 odd from Accrington. Torquay today were slow to get going and looked disjointed. We hardly had a goal attempt of note. We had some decent spells of possession but we never seriously threatened. Accrington should have taken the lead and only an amazing flying save from Poke saved a cetain goal. Poke needed to be alert on other occasions as well. Poke had to tip 1 back header from O'Connor over the bar and punch away a fierce free-kick smartly. Torquay were lucky to go in at half-time on level terms.
Torquay did improve a bit after the break and exerted some pressure in spells. Nicholson replaced Cruise at half-time. But it was the same old story - we don't have any finishers at the club and the loanees quite frankly are making it worse. Marquis earlier in the season was the only loanee striker who I rate. We did miss Stickley's physical prescence today, was he injured? As far as i'm concerned we should send back Wilkinson and O'Brien back to their parent clubs and at least try our own players like Yeoman. He surely cannot do any worse. Goodwin did have 1 decent shot today so perhaps he should be playing in attack and not on the wing. Accrington showed us how to finish on 80 minutes.
I'm sorry to have to say this but Hargreaves seems to be making a right hash of things and we are getting worse. Too reliant on untried loanee youngsters, too much chopping and changing. Loads of forwards but no-one who can find the back of the net. No penetration from midfield. I would at least like to see players like Craig, Cameron, Yeoman, Thompson given a chance but most of them have been shipped out on loan. Where is the direction of the team. At least Ling got the best out of our own players but Hargreaves has gone down the Knill route. On a personal level, as a regular home supporter I have had enough. I will not be going to the Burton game on Tuesday and until I see a sign of some hope that things might improve and some direction I don't want to see any more of what I witnessed today. I feel genuinely sorry for Gulls supporters who will continue to go to our games. I have suffered enough and will have a break from going to games, it's got so bad. So come on Hargreaves and players at least give us supporters something to cheer about. Only Poke and Pearce come out with any credit today.
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Feb 22, 2014 18:20:17 GMT
Grim.
Before today, I was confident we could scrape our way to 50 points.
I was also confident that two out of Northampton, Wycombe, Mansfield, Accrington and Bury would fail to get to 50.
We won't get 50 points playing like that.
Results elsewhere don't make it look like anyone else is in freefall.
Buggar.
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Post by frankfurt gull on Feb 22, 2014 18:22:42 GMT
Where do we go from here? If the likes of Swanny (who I just happen to know) withdraw their dedicated support (although I personally believe he will be at the next home game) then the Club has got a problem. At this moment in time I just don´t see a way out of this mess - it is Conference League next season and the sooner everybody gets used to the idea the better.
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petef
Match Room Manager
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Post by petef on Feb 22, 2014 18:24:28 GMT
Labadie will be no miss he's been dragged down to our level now and looks to be losing interest fast.
Swanny we didn't create anything for the strikers to finish. Wilkinson, Stockley, Goodwin, O'brien, Ball, Aziz,Benyon, Hawley, etc etc etc may be a good finisher if put in on goal - Same old story little creativity from the middle of the park when the wide areas are bogged down.
We don't have a decent wing back at the club and haven't had for a long time. Cruise awful Tonge awful Nicholson past it Mansell no good anywhere he plays.
Far to many passengers now who just haven't got any fire in their bellies. The one thing I thought Hargreaves would have instilled in the squad and that was fight and pashion and a will to do better.Non existent today.
Also decided enough is enough and am staying away for my own sanity.
Cannot stomach players who show no fight or passion.
Start planning for the Conference or we will continue to tumble down the football pyramid.
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Feb 22, 2014 20:07:58 GMT
![]() Grim. Results elsewhere don't make it look like anyone else is in freefall. Buggar. My thoughts going into this game, were that if we lost this six pointer (coming so soon after the Cobblers game) then it would be a case of who's for the drop with us. We huffed and puffed but could not match Accy for passing and/or moving into space (like this season so far) but we did have a good penalty shout waved away and had a couple of shots headed off the line by the melon shaped head of Liddle. Accy then had the brain wave of bringing on a striker who could change the game (rather unfair of them) and he did by scoring in the 80th minute, where as we changed Nicholson for Cruise (assume Cruise was injured) and O'Brien and Danny with 2 minutes to go. Even those Northern tosspots Chesterfield could not be relied on either to do us a favour. All in all a depressing day  |
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Post by bristolgull on Feb 22, 2014 20:56:23 GMT
Knives out already for CH in certain quarters....Ridiculous.
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Post by loyalgull on Feb 22, 2014 22:00:37 GMT
resigned myself to the fact we wont get out of this now,northampton was truly awful,this was even worse,but its not hargreaves fault, largish squad but no quality.And awful to watch,its been dire fayre for a long time now,to the point of absolutely boring
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hector
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Post by hector on Feb 23, 2014 11:09:51 GMT
Yesterday was a game that they simply had to win. Whilst this result on its own does not condemn us to relegation, it certainly felt like it. With 6 of our next 8 games at home and this being the first, there was a real opportunity to harvest some much needed points but I think yesterday was such a low that it will take some time for the supporters and club to recover. It seems to have signaled a resignation to our fate amongst even normally positive, optimistic supporters. Yesterday we had to win - it was against Accrington, for heavens sake - if you cannot beat teams like that when your backs are against the wall, then who can you beat?
The prospect of another home game so soon after the shambles yesterday is probably not one anyone, supporters or players will relish. On the other hand, the Burton game is perhaps THE chance to rectify and kick-start Hargreaves management because you cannot get much lower than two consecutive home defeats to Northampton & Accrington. Northampton and Accrington were both must-win games that were unbelievably thrown away. Burton now, is even more 'must-win'. Anything less will probably confirm what we all know anyway.
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Post by Ditmar van Nostrilboy on Feb 23, 2014 11:54:25 GMT
Knives out already for CH in certain quarters....Ridiculous. Of course it's barking. That's the nature of fickle fans though.... What I would say though is there's a bit of tactical nous going awry somewhere. Our best overall performances are probably (in no particular order) the wins against Dagenham, Southend and Wimbledon. We were quite lucky against Pompey and I dont think backs against the wall playing a team that didnt appear to know where the bloody goal is necessarily considered a good performance. It was a great occasion playing somewhere like that and a valuable 3 points (thank god the ref didnt see the handball right at the end) but not that good a performance. What do the the three matches I highlighted have in common? We played a 4-3-3 that had a solid defence and the midfield made sure they out-played the opposition and pressed them up the pitch. We restricted the opposition to very few chances and kept it tight all over the pitch. Im not going to say that will work in every match, particularly on some of the wider pitches, but surely against relegation rivals on a narrowish, bumpy pitch (no offence Aus and the rest of the ground crew cos you cant control the weather) that should have been the way to go? Instead it's 4-4-2 with wingers that dont seem to be able to shield their fullbacks when needed, nor do they seem prepared to swap side to give the opposition something new to think about. |
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Post by bristolgull on Feb 23, 2014 12:10:05 GMT
You make good points ditmar. CH is still a rookie manager learning his trade and working out his best side. I wonder if his appointment did have half an eye on him rebuilding a team in the conference next season. No disrespect to anybody intended. I am a little disappointed that he has carried on a la Knill and shipped in more loanees. Goodwin and O'Connor aside, send them back and allow yeoman a go perhaps?
I have just reacquainted myself with our remaining fixtures....as if we didn't already know, it doesn't look good. Anyway I'm behind CH at the moment and if it doesn't work this season then let's see how he can rebuild and reinvigorate the club next season...
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petef
Match Room Manager
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Post by petef on Feb 23, 2014 12:35:13 GMT
Knives out already for CH in certain quarters....Ridiculous. Of course it's barking. That's the nature of fickle fans though.... What I would say though is there's a bit of tactical nous going awry somewhere. Our best overall performances are probably (in no particular order) the wins against Dagenham, Southend and Wimbledon. We were quite lucky against Pompey and I dont think backs against the wall playing a team that didnt appear to know where the bloody goal is necessarily considered a good performance. It was a great occasion playing somewhere like that and a valuable 3 points (thank god the ref didnt see the handball right at the end) but not that good a performance. What do the the three matches I highlighted have in common? We played a 4-3-3 that had a solid defence and the midfield made sure they out-played the opposition and pressed them up the pitch. We restricted the opposition to very few chances and kept it tight all over the pitch. Im not going to say that will work in every match, particularly on some of the wider pitches, but surely against relegation rivals on a narrowish, bumpy pitch (no offence Aus and the rest of the ground crew cos you cant control the weather) that should have been the way to go? Instead it's 4-4-2 with wingers that dont seem to be able to shield their fullbacks when needed, nor do they seem prepared to swap side to give the opposition something new to think about. I couldn't understand it either DVN with a bog of a pitch we revert back to the Knill tactics that got us into this mess with two wide men along with Hawley and Wilkinson and just two in midfield. Where the f*** was Damon? somebody please tell me because the only semblence of any sort of performance of late has been with him in front of the defence in a three man midfield. It was working to a degree now all of a sudden he's disappeared. If he's injured or unavailable through illness then tell the bloody supporters and we may just understand why. Downes( yes he's slow but he leads by example even when his form is off) has to come back with O'conner at full back - Harrop could see it for one game when he also also re-introduced Lathrope back and we played well enough to win a match. Greavsy was then appointed and came in with his own ideas and now he appears to be clutching at straws with tactics and team selection. We are a shambles on the pitch and the sittuation is becoming more confused as each day passes one or two players surprised me with their lack of commitment yesterday and that makes you wonder what may be going on behind the scenes. I hope the manager still has the players on his side, all wee ever see is the jovial media savy Chris Hargreaves but I know from witnessing certain things in his playing days that he had a sharp tongue with younger players in particular. On the player front five seasons on we still have run of the mill players in Mansell and Nicholson. We seem incapable of progress in player standard, unable to hold on to any gems we may happen to sign and have stood still for to long it was inevitable that it would catch up on us eventually. Yesterday was the culmination of that for me. In the back ground we have the Yeomans and Thompsons etc who, by all accounts would take on the mantle the home grown talent to secure our future in the football league. Never going to happen was it? Burton ? give them the points now we don't stand a chance with those players and tactics. Lucky to see 1500 there on Tuesday. |
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Post by Budleigh on Feb 23, 2014 12:59:20 GMT
Northampton was a 'must-win' game; we lost. So Accrington became a 'really must-win' game; we lost.
Burton now becomes a 'really, really must-win' game.
(ps: how many 'must-win' games can you lose and still need 'must-win' games to stay out of trouble? Or are there 'must-win' games and 'must-win' games?)
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Post by Ditmar van Nostrilboy on Feb 23, 2014 13:19:17 GMT
Alas Bud, we really need to be getting points against fellow relegation strugglers, so from that point of view Northampton and Accy were both probably "must-win" games. With defeat in both however, I can see no way back and the conference beckons. If you cant get points against the teams around you at the bottom, you're usually ****ed.
We're now 5 points adrift with a worse goal difference (effectively 6 points then). We havnt been that far behind so far (I dont think?) and this is certainly not the time of the season for that to happen...
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hector
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Post by hector on Feb 23, 2014 13:40:33 GMT
The last time we were probably this far adrift was under Atkins and then we had that crazy run. A crazy run is not going to happen while the team is chopped and changed every game. There are certain players who could be relied upon: Poke, O'Connor, Pearce, Downes, Lathrope with a couple of others who do well when the going is good - Labadie/Chapell. Left-back is an issue. Neither Cruise or Nicholson possess the tenacity, pace or aggression that our current predicament demands. Hopefully, a fit Cooper will address that area, if that is one of the places he can play.
Sadly, the loss of Rene Howe has been a key reason we have struggled. I cannot see any of the EIGHT forwards we have on our books (including those we have loaned out) being effective enough. Perhaps Chapell should play there - he cannot do any worse and is more likely to score than any of them. Despite some stick I have read on the forums, I didn't think young Wilkinson did too badly whilst I am not sure what people have seen in Goodwin.
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Feb 23, 2014 14:37:24 GMT
Northampton was a 'must-win' game; we lost. So Accrington became a 'really must-win' game; we lost. Burton now becomes a 'really, really must-win' game. (ps: how many 'must-win' games can you lose and still need 'must-win' games to stay out of trouble? Or are there 'must-win' games and 'must-win' games?) Northampton and Accrington were 6 pointer games we must win games, where as the Burton is only a 3 pointer must win game. |
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