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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2016 4:24:07 GMT
Stalin once said...'It's not the votes that count, it's the people counting the votes that count!' His country wasn't in the EU though! EU members like ourselves do things properly! We're not in the EU either!
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Post by stefano on Jun 24, 2016 4:53:33 GMT
We're not in the EU either! I think you will find we are and I would guess for at least another 3 years. It would be silly to invoke Article 50 as soon as it gets light so as there is so much to get in place that will take another year, then it is two years after that. Quite apart from an exit from the EU there is the small matter of dealing with the exit of Scotland from the UK and sorting out the border relationship with the Republic of Ireland (where Sinn Fein are already calling for a united Ireland following this bizarre vote). Although my voting area turned in a vote of 'Remain' I know of people who were going to vote 'Leave' as a protest vote but knowing that 'Remain' would be the outcome. Looks like that happened across the country, so you reap what you sow!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2016 5:11:24 GMT
We're not in the EU either! I think you will find we are and I would guess for at least another 3 years. It would be silly to invoke Article 50 as soon as it gets light so as there is so much to get in place that will take another year, then it is two years after that. Quite apart from an exit from the EU there is the small matter of dealing with the exit of Scotland from the UK and sorting out the border relationship with the Republic of Ireland (where Sinn Fein are already calling for a united Ireland following this bizarre vote). Although my voting area turned in a vote of 'Remain' I know of people who were going to vote 'Leave' as a protest vote but knowing that 'Remain' would be the outcome. Looks like that happened across the country, so you reap what you sow! I think by the time Scotland get yet another chance to leave us, the people of France will have voted to leave the basket case that is the EU. So as much as I would like for Scotland to leave (another country we give billions to) it ain't gonna happen! What a great day this is!
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Post by stefano on Jun 24, 2016 5:21:59 GMT
I think by the time Scotland get yet another chance to leave us, the people of France will have voted to leave the basket case that is the EU. So as much as I would like for Scotland to leave (another country we give billions to) it ain't gonna happen! What a great day this is! 'It ain't going to happen' is the truest thing you have said for weeks. In a couple of years time you will be able to say you heard it here first - the UK will not leave the EU when 48% of the population don't want to!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2016 5:29:37 GMT
I think by the time Scotland get yet another chance to leave us, the people of France will have voted to leave the basket case that is the EU. So as much as I would like for Scotland to leave (another country we give billions to) it ain't gonna happen! What a great day this is! 'It ain't going to happen' is the truest thing you have said for weeks. In a couple of years time you will be able to say you heard it here first - the UK will not leave the EU when 48% of the population don't want to! I know you're upset Stefano, but you're not listening, if France and possibly even Germany voting to leave the basket case known as the EU...there will be no EU state to be a member of! What a great day this is!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2016 8:09:59 GMT
Well, one thing is clear after watching all this kerfuffle from about 04.00 this morning...Labour MP's have lost touch with reality! They still won't accept that mass immigration is the reason we are now out (well, maybe not according to Stefano ) of the basket case known as the EU! Of course our chances of getting out are increased now with Cameron doing the right thing and quitting! Which will trigger another round of voting, but with a Brexiter taking charge. Of course it will be in house like Corbett was elected, so let's hope they put a proper MP in charge and not a lunatic! Although, if there is an early election coming up, which is possible with a proper party in power, Corbett will be booted out by his own side! What a great day this is!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2016 9:46:42 GMT
stefano Driving home last night, and as the 10pm news came on the car radio, the headline was that the Currency Traders and Stock Exchange whizz kids had their own polling information leading them to gamble heavily on 'Remain', and so reap the expected quick profits. By 11pm we were hearing that the housing estates,where a General Election turnout of 30%, or in very exceptional cases reaches 40%, were on this occasion seeing 80% making the trip to the Polling Station. Today we wake to see the BBC in mourning, and the Guardianistas choking on their cornflakes croissants, while those same speculators are desperately trying to cut their losses having put their money on the wrong horse. But we also wake to the confirmation that an incredible example of working class solidarity (particularly up North) has carried the day. I'm sure the Sunday broadsheets will analyse the voting patterns in forensic detail, but it all points to that being the conclusion. I'm sure that Farage's observation was intended to be taken as a generalisation, and in that respect, once the analysis of the way 'ordinary' people voted, it will be proven, in the main, to be correct. Stefano is, as no one in TUFC circles needs reminding, the epitome of decency, and held in the highest regard by those who's opinion he surely values much more than Nigel Farage's . In broad general terms I'd say it did boil down to a straight fight between the Working Class v The Guardianistas, pisshead Lefty students, the metropolitan elite and the backers of global capitalism. An enthralling contest, and as Andrew Neal observed part way through the night, there was the frightening prospect at times that London might force the rest of us to continue licking the E.U jackboot. A campaign in which Cameron tried to talk the country down, and in which the Remainers seem to have had no clue what to do other than scream 'Racist' at their opponents over and over again, rather than attempt to come up with any kind of realistic hope to offer ordinary people, finally, and deservedly, came up short. Cameron did the decent thing, and has booked a date for the removal vans to call round at No.10. Gideon's days at No.11 need to be cut short urgently as well. I do hope that Nigel Farage is rightly upset for causing offence to Stefano, although there's no reason why he shouldn't also be enjoying the gratitude and praise coming his way from many others.
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Post by stefano on Jun 24, 2016 10:21:53 GMT
What? Complete lack of interest! I stayed up all night (and drank only coffee so that I didn't become offensive on football forums!)
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2016 11:48:32 GMT
Indeed, Farage is a national hero! Make no mistake, it was him and him alone that has managed to get us out of the EU basket case! Cameron, was clever enough (or Labour were too stupid, or just had total contempt as usual for the British public) to realise that he had to offer the referendum to guarantee an election win...it worked of course. Other people of course see Farage as a racist! If someone doesn't agree with you, and you have run out of anything plausible to say...just pull out the old racist card! It's a bit like being in Primary school. Someone will argue with you then run away whilst shouting that you're Hitler over their shoulder! It's a shame that he will never get into power, but at least he did make UKIP the second most popular party in the country!
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Post by rjdgull on Jun 24, 2016 12:50:22 GMT
I think by the time Scotland get yet another chance to leave us, the people of France will have voted to leave the basket case that is the EU. So as much as I would like for Scotland to leave (another country we give billions to) it ain't gonna happen! What a great day this is! 'It ain't going to happen' is the truest thing you have said for weeks. In a couple of years time you will be able to say you heard it here first - the UK will not leave kthe EU when 48% of the population don't want to! Not sure that is how democracy works? However, the closeness of the result should very much be taken into consideration. Lots of twists and turns for Scotland - will Spain veto their membership? Will their electorate want to adopt the euro? Will they have less freedom in a federal Europe without a UK brake?
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Post by tqriviera on Jun 24, 2016 15:34:01 GMT
Cheer up Stefano!
"Well as the pound in my pocket is apparently worth virtually nothing now I must pass on my thanks to the great British public for making entry to Plainmoor out of the price range of the ordinary person"
The quote from Harold Wilson all those years ago is still valid!
From now on, the pound abroad is worth 14 per cent or so less in terms of other currencies. That doesn't mean, of course, that the Pound here in Britain, in your pocket or purse or in your bank, has been devalued.
For a start, the pound is "only" down around 5% against the Euro and, as long as you are not going over to Europe to watch the Bundesliga, you should still be able to afford to go to Plainmoor - as nothing has changed and your lovely £ 20 note will still buy as much as before!!
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Post by stefano on Jun 24, 2016 16:17:28 GMT
The quote from Harold Wilson all those years ago is still valid! From now on, the pound abroad is worth 14 per cent or so less in terms of other currencies. That doesn't mean, of course, that the Pound here in Britain, in your pocket or purse or in your bank, has been devalued. Yes ....and so is the one from Winston Churchill in 1945 when he said that the only way to avoid further devestating European wars was to come together in a union of European countries. I will bow to his experience and Statemanship.
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Post by stefano on Jun 24, 2016 16:25:51 GMT
Not sure that is how democracy works? Well I suppose it depends on what type of democracy is operating. There are different interpretations as to what democracy is. Is it a country of 65 million people having to follow the wishes of 17.5 million? Well of course not all the 65 million are eligible to vote. But about 49 million are.....still makes 17.5 million a minority. I'm looking forward to seeing how Bernadette Devlin Nicola Sturgeon plays it!
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Post by forevertufc on Jun 24, 2016 17:30:09 GMT
Well yes and no Steff. Around 36 million people voted, 13 million couldn't be bothered , therefore they no longer count in the equation as they did not exercise their right to vote.
So the majority won.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2016 17:45:54 GMT
Not sure that is how democracy works? Well I suppose it depends on what type of democracy is operating. There are different interpretations as to what democracy is. Is it a country of 65 million people having to follow the wishes of 17.5 million? Well of course not all the 65 million are eligible to vote. But about 49 million are.....still makes 17.5 million a minority. I'm looking forward to seeing how Bernadette Devlin Nicola Sturgeon plays it! It doesn't matter if there were 7 billion people in the country (which there probably would be if the abhorrent Tony Blair was still in power) and if only 3 could be arsed to vote, and 2 wanted us to leave, that is a democratic vote! Bernadette Devlin...shit, I haven't heard that name for a while, you must be as old as I am! Nicola Sturgeon...does anyone think she looks like Helena Bonham-Carter in the original Planet of the Apes...without any make up on!
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