Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2017 17:27:21 GMT
A well intentioned suggestion gullone, but TUST would need to think the implications through very carefully before making such a move. But I'd wholeheartedly agree with your advice that they should steer clear of targets in future, having got their fingers badly burned in the past.
TUST already suffer from their image as an organisation set up by, and appealing to, the Guardian reading middle class. Slap an annual membership fee of £120 on, and the last handful of people who weren't convinced before about the Lefty Elitism of TUST, finally will be. They need to hang on to those who initially fell for the 'safety net' spiel, and chuck £2 in without examining Supporters Direct too closely. It is those less affluent members who, what they don't contribute in cash, do at least provide some credibility, but they're going to question whether occasional newsletter style emails are good value at £10 a month......lose their membership and the Guardianistas who are worryingly numerous, would then totally dominate things to an even greater extent. While I fully appreciate that a boost to funds would be most welcome, heading towards a situation where it becomes nigh on impossible to find a TUST member not wearing a Corbyn T shirt, will only make the organisation a (bigger) laughing stock.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2017 11:55:29 GMT
It's sad to see TUST limping on, leaderless and rudderless, and the cobwebs attached to their 'Update' thread which should surely have it's sticky status reviewed, given the inactivity. G.I have now got their own men in, the Owers & Kuhl team know what the ownership want, and wouldn't have been appointed without the necessary enthusiasm to enforce that agenda. Just consider Gary's words as reported today: "It's so nice, it can't be nice all the time when you're struggling, some people have to ask themselves why is this still going on?" said Owers. "We need a bit of devil about the place," he told BBC Sport. "It's got to change - people inside the club, outside the club - things have to change, attitudes have to change."
In essence Gary is calling for a G.I mindset, throughout the club, and not just at Ownership level. 'A bit of devil about the place' as he says, and Clarke Osborne can't be expected to provide all the devilish drive single handed. Chief Devil maybe, but the rest of us need to step up to the plate and follow his example, as do the players. The opposition trying to prevent us moving forward has never been weaker. TUST seemingly unable to find a Leader for love nor money. Lobbing Supporters Direct publications, and possibly a variety of Socialist pamphlets his way, is about the sum of the Red Resistance at present, lacking both motivation and ideas. Hoping that providing a selection of Red Reading will convert Clarke to Socialism, or deflect Osborne or Owers from their 'Devil take the hindmost' philosophy, just won't work . TUST need a leader soon, and a relaunch, even prominent militants seem to have lost their revolutionary zeal. It's all very well hoping that local council busy bodies will thwart the club's plans and do all the work, while TUST cheer from the sidelines, but that's not what the membership will judge as providing value for their subscriptions. I'm sure I'm not the only critical friend of TUST severely underwhelmed by their lack of activity as they seemingly go down without a fight. It's time for a new charismatic TUST leader, one who can step up and proclaim the Socialist message loud and clear, because just at the moment it's looking like the Devil has all the best tunes.
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simonb
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Post by simonb on Nov 18, 2017 17:32:06 GMT
This would be a credit to the Daily Mail!
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hector
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Post by hector on Nov 19, 2017 10:31:58 GMT
Is there anyone left still paying their TUST membership fees? And if so, why? Because there needs to be the semblance of something once Clarke Osborne finally screws the club over.
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Nov 19, 2017 11:40:18 GMT
Is there anyone left still paying their TUST membership fees? And if so, why? Me, and echo Hectors point.
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simonb
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Post by simonb on Nov 19, 2017 15:42:49 GMT
Are you trying to draw parallels with the Conservative Party?!
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hector
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Post by hector on Nov 19, 2017 15:57:40 GMT
Because there needs to be the semblance of something once Clarke Osborne finally screws the club over. A 'semblance of something' certainly describes a small number of fans, with no leadership, none of whom seem willing to step into the void left by Michael. Quite how that can help the club, I'm not sure. Is it any wonder? The constant, sniping, belittling, undermining of an organisation for supporters by supporters, then it’s no surprise. Why on earth should they bother? Supporters have the club they deserve.
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Nov 19, 2017 16:12:00 GMT
Seems to be of higher priority than the future of the club to a tiny minority who have never shown the organisation any support. Thankfully not everyone just rolled over and let property developers have the freehold and kill us off as has been the case elsewhere. Maybe next time the move is made they will have a better chance of killing us. I hear they might be squeezing a few more houses onto the Swindon site. No drainage issues for them. I take it the prefab is still in the South Wales shed for that multi-broken promise? RIP Racers. Anyone for Swedish meatballs? www.ikea.com/gb/en/store/bristol/restaurant-bristol/
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2017 9:41:41 GMT
As Jon informs us on the Updates thread, the future of TUST will for the foreseeable future be under the leadership of Mike Thomas. I think we should all wish him well from the outset as he takes up his new position as TUST Chairman. Sadly, it will be a long road back to credibility for TUST given the widely publicised debacles they suffered (instigated ?) not too long ago. But hopefully lessons have been learned and they can gradually claw themselves back to some kind of respectability among the greater fan base.
While I did receive an email last night pointing out that Mike was always likely to have an initial advantage of being subliminally popular with the Militant wing of TUST: Michael Thomas Marxist Theory
I think we can all see how that works, although I wouldn't put too much store by it, as there were other reasons why Mike garnered 100% of the votes cast...assuming a ballot was held at all. It will be fascinating to see whether TUST now attempt to present themselves in a different light in order to appeal to to a greater proportion of ordinary fans. Let's hope Mike can bring some fresh thinking to the role, and in so doing help TUST throw off the cloak of Corbynism that to so many currently surrounds it. No easy task with an influential and vocal Militant wing to contend with, but I'm sure he'd have the support of the vast majority of Torquay fans far and wide, should he choose to undertake such a task.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2018 12:12:58 GMT
Fourteen pages, that really does demonstrate TFF members continued fascination as regards the future of TUST. Not too long ago we feared that TUST might disappear below the horizon never to be seen again; a red speck in the distance, and how we would have missed it. Yet as we enter 2018, both for seasoned TUST watchers like myself, or for those new to the hobby, there are signs that it's breathing a little more easily, although still dependent on the G.I ventilator of course, giving it access to not only monthly meetings, but also the benefit of joint collaborations with Clarke and Bernie's Official TUFC supporters club. It's too easy to be sceptical and say that being 12 points adrift from safety and on the back of a 4-0 defeat, the ground would always be fertile to pick up a new member or two. OK, while there's no denying that Owers & Kuhl are proving to be unwitting recruiting sergeants for TUST, let's also give TUST a pat on the back for their sensible approach at a difficult time. Some months back when there was last a major hoo-ha (was it around the time of Nico's sacking ?) and the Forums were in meltdown, the demands for TUST to 'say something' grew louder . At such a time it's always wise just to be seen to be doing something, however trivial. TUST put out a statement that was in essence, nothing more than a rehash of a few points made in their last newsletter, but it worked a treat, and the baying mob of Militants were soon pacified. Fast forward to this week, and it was same problem, same solution. 'Where the hell are TUST at a time like this ??' And again it was necessary to deploy the art of saying something while effectively saying nothing: 'Blah blah blah, working hard behind the scenes, blah blah, discussions, blah blah dialogue, and working even harder behind the scenes than in an earlier paragraph' Again, perfect for the occasion, the non statement proving it's enduring effectiveness. But let's not confine our praise of TUST there. Yesterday's follow up was also a huge cause for optimism. A communication listing the progress and improvements being made at Plainmoor under Clarke Osborne's ownership. Guaranteed to get the TUST Militants frothing at the mouth as they read it, but hopefully setting down a marker that under new leadership and in this new year, the mistakes of pandering to it's Militant wing while alienating ordinary fans will not be repeated, however much that might upset the Hard Left faction of the membership. And so on to ' the letter'. Ideally this will have already been choreographed with the Club. 'Look we need to be seen to be asking some questions just now' and in line with the new spirit of cooperation, the Clubs communications team can help out: 'OK, so why don't you ask us, this, this, and this....and Clarke will gladly rephrase some of his earlier statements on sustainable success, etc ?'Given the common sense approach we've seen recently, we can have high hopes that such a joint solution to quieting Militant fist banging is being undertaken. What we surely all hope is that TUST haven't decided to go rogue and fired off some heat of the moment questions that would both annoy Clarke and set back their relationship with the club. The signs are good; Clarke's answers are required 'in order to clarify the future situation on and off the field'. If this letter has presented Clarke with a fairly soft ball, then I foresee he'll agree to gently pat it back in the same friendly spirit, remembering to include the necessary reassurances asked for. Well done TUST. Only small steps of course, but a really encouraging level headed approach recently. Let's hope you've put the bad old ways behind you for good.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2018 13:28:22 GMT
While fans are feeling too depressed by results and our League position to want to talk about the football, for we TUST watchers it's a fascinating time. As one particular Forum is throwing itself headlong into discussions of what the TUST should be doing right now, by way of contrast I thought a more historical perspective would make a nice alternative here. While at the same time emphasising a point that can't have it's importance stressed too greatly: it's the people who control and pull the strings at national level who you need to investigate and find out about. They wield the power, as is being only to clearly demonstrated at Hartlepool at this very moment. Fans must not allow themselves to think no further than the friendly faces of TUST officialdom at local level. It is the London power brokers of Supporters Direct that take charge the moment the serious stuff starts. I wonder if I've been the only one this week, struck by the similarities between TUFC owned by the Dave Philips consortium; those final months when discussions with TUST took place, and what we hear and read of what's happening at Hartlepool currently ? These are my recollections, and TUST members may well have a better informed or more accurate knowledge than myself, but from what I recall, TUST were allowed in and were given access to the books and to examine the accounts. Of course previously, Dave Philips had observed in his programme notes that not a penny, not even a lawnmower, had been forthcoming from TUST.....and how it mirrors the sorry tale of Hartlepool today. In a nutshell didn't TUST's offer of help eventually boil down to saying 'our help will be in taking the club off your hands' ? The bigger, and eventually insurmountable snag, was that TUST then demanded a period of exclusivity that went right up to the date on which the G.I loans had to be repaid, i.e effectively putting anyone else out of the running. A condition that Philips and Co refused to agree to. So now let's move North East to Hartlepool. and see what the members of the Hartlepool United Supports Trust have been being told over recent days and weeks. You know the people, those loyal fans paying in monthly so that a safety net would be there. If their club was struggling to survive, as supporters they'd do what they could to come to the rescue. And that is just what their Trust told them, even right up to the start of this week ! Let's see what was being reported and what the Hartlepool Trust was telling fans and members locally: The Supporters' Trust is now bidding to ensure the club can prosper in the longer-term, and says it will launch its own campaign in the coming days. A statement released by the trust said: "The trust has a major national fundraising campaign prepared which was sanctioned by our members on December 31, 2017, and we expect to launch this in the next four to five days. Many of you will indeed have helped us with the promotional video for this which we filmed at the ground on January 1, 2018. Our campaign is not designed to supplant or hijack the excellent fundraising effort already going on in response to the club's appeal for £200,000 that they need by January 25. The reality is that those funds will only secure the future of the club this month, and not for the remaining months of the season. The HUST campaign is to raise money for a fighting fund to cover operational costs through to June."
Just what the locals wanted. The Trust for once not playing politics, but actually helping to raise some money to stop the club going to the wall. Three cheers for Tru..... hang on...what ? There's been a call from Head Office ? Supporters Direct have heard about the plans to launch a fund to help, and they've forbidden it. That's right folks, Big Brother at HQ slaps down local TUST and puts them firmly in their place. Politics is always on the agenda at HQ because it's their only agenda ! And so the shame faced local Trust leaders are forced into an astonishing about-turn. As they meekly comply with Supporters Direct and the overriding agenda.And so what did they have to tell local Hartlepool Trust members yesterday ? 'After speaking to Supporters Direct, we have decided to further postpone our fund-raising launch, which we had initially planned for last week, while we seek further legal advice. While we support all efforts to save the Club, as part of our Constitution we must remain independent of Hartlepool United Football Club until such time that supporters have a representative on the Board of HUFC'. And don't think that the local Militants hadn't thought of an additional pound of flesh to demand either, as the statement went on: "In addition, many of our members and prospective donors, have told us that they do not want the Trust to give money directly to the club, particularly without access to the club’s accounts"
While the ordinary fans are reaching into their pockets and raising every penny they can, you don't need me to identify just who is in favour of thinking up new conditions and demands. I think by now we can recognise the words and deeds of a Trust Militant, even if they're operating as far away as Hartlepool ! Oh yeah, and while the fans are trying to raise money for the poor sods who aren't getting paid, Hartlepool Trust make it clear they wouldn't as much as lift a finger to help with the administration "Much of the money that is currently needed is for salaries, and as a Trust we cannot pay those salaries or administer donations which will go towards them, without attracting the attention of HMRC, or leaving ourselves open to a potential claim for tax and National Insurance.The importance of getting the message across continues. Do not concern yourselves with who Supporters Direct slap a TUST badge on, and dangle before you at local level. It's the people who control their strings up in London, and even the people behind those people who you need to inform yourselves about. It's a time when pro TUST views are available by the lorry load, when some Forums are overflowing with the pro TUST message. That means some small alternative to the overwhelming narrative is more important than ever. TUST Watch will continue to provide that as best it can while it's allowed to.
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simonb
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Post by simonb on Jan 17, 2018 17:39:00 GMT
Succinct must be word of the day!
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rjdgull
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Post by rjdgull on Jan 17, 2018 23:16:23 GMT
Alpine, everyone is allowed to have an opinion on here - Voltaire etc. Without studying the Hartlepoo! scenario in depth the stance of supporters Direct does not appear to be unreasonable as the amounts being mooted are not in the lawnmower category but are more akin to providing significant injections of share capital which generally entitles that party into a say into how that money is spent..
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Jan 17, 2018 23:32:10 GMT
Good point. What AJ further fails to mention is that Jeff Stelling is President of Hartlepoool United Supporters Trust, so this is probably worthy of his Fake News stamp on that omission alone.
HUST - Now that rings a bell or at least will do when we are playing Hereford next season. A club reinvigorated by its fans having suffered more than most at the hands of malevolent ownership.
No doubt AJ will gloss over Osborne’s association with that Club in the same way he has forgotten Jeff Stelling being the Hartlepool trust president.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2018 0:15:52 GMT
rjdgull Thanks for those reassuring words rjd. And as to your other point, I would pretty much agree with it 100%. However what I hoped to highlight, and which is always a thing I attempt to stress most clearly in discussions regarding TUST, is the lack of knowledge ordinary members, and even some of their leaders at local level have, regarding their London based masters. "The trust has a major national fundraising campaign prepared which was sanctioned by our members on December 31, 2017, and we expect to launch this in the next four to five days".
These poor sops thought the power was in their hands, they thought they could decide what to do with the money they had raised. There they were sanctioning away, totally oblivious to the fact that they could carry on sanctioning until they were blue in the face, and it wouldn't matter; they didn't know that they're not even allowed to contribute as much as the cost of a lawnmower to the football club they support, let alone raise a more significant sum to help out. At local level they stressed how badly they wanted the Football club's staff to be paid, again oblivious to the fact that was a specific area to which they could not use TUST funds for. And so whether the amount was a huge sum, enough for a lawnmower, or for two sherbet dips is immaterial......Supports Direct would still have issued a 'NO' instruction. As an aside, do you think Rob's attempt to redefine Fake News will catch on ??.......no neither do I .
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