|
|
Post by frobisher on Nov 15, 2009 12:23:05 GMT
So how is my post stating that I would have preferred to see Benyon up front rather than Thomson who does not strike me at all as a centre forward,anti the manager. I can only speak on what I have seen of the players, and that is only a very limited view of Thomson.
Its actually my opinion that Benyon and Sills are our best partnership.
My view is as well that this is fault which the manager has shown time and time again ie playing players in their incorrect positions.
Perhaps the view is not so nonsensical as Mr Merson seems to think as Paul Buckle actually changed Thomson back to the wing at the start of the second half.
Perhaps our upturn in form maybe in some part now down to us having players in positions they are comfortable for example not having a centre half at right back.
|
|
Dave
TFF member
Posts: 13,081
|
Post by Dave on Nov 15, 2009 12:24:51 GMT
Hope you have a great time and any match report and photos will aways be welcome. Darryl's match reports have improved ten fold since he became a member on the TFF and learned from the many expert match reporters we have on here.  |
|
|
|
Post by lambethgull on Nov 15, 2009 12:24:57 GMT
Having seen both the Cheltenham FA Cup game last week and the Shrewsbury game yesterday, it was striking how different these games were.
If last week's game was a typical incident-packed FA Cup game (albeit with the unusual spectacle of two penalties in the first half), yesterday's was a typical attritional lower-league battle. Shrewsbury were clearly struggling to overcome recent setbacks - characterised by their subdued, morose even fans (some of whom took to booing their team's substitutes in the 2nd half after we took the lead). United on the other hand took to the pitch reasonably high on confidence after a run of hard-fought and well-earned results and the hesitancy and lack of confidence seen during away performances this season at places like Dagenham, Bradford and Macclesfield was notably lacking.
At no time at all did this game ever represent a classic, but it was the kind of game and performance which is needed on soggy, wintry away fixtures and on which league-survival is built on.
Bucks opted to place Stevens and Carlisle on the flanks with a central midfield of Hargreaves and Thompson. Sills played up front, with Jake Thomson playing a less advanced position behind Sills. The logic behind Buckle's thinking appeared sound. Although the chutzpah displayed to such exciting effect last week was missing from his performance yesterday, on a couple of occasions Thomson almost broke through, but on the whole was kept in check. Shrewsbury on the other hand had a couple of tricky wingers (particularly the gloved one mentioned above), but their finishing was poor and I only recall Poke having one (excellent) save to make throughout the first half.
At half time Buckle brought Stevens off for Benyon, putting Thomson out wide. The second half changed when Charnock got sent off for what looked like a lunge in the 53rd minute. Bucks decided to withdraw Thomson for Ellis. Thomson didn't look too pleased to be taken off, but it was the right decision in the circumstances.
The rest of the game saw us under a fair amount of pressure. Benyon did an excellent job of holding the ball up and making a nuisance of himself. Credit to him also for managing to stay on his feet on such a greasy pitch - something that can't always be said of Elliott.
I thought Hargreaves was superb yesterday, just edging the excellent Wayne Carlisle for MoTM imo. He never stopped talking to and encouraging his teammates and he deserved his goal, even though it took a deflection. A team with more confidence in front of goal than Shrewsbury might have made more of their second half pressure. True, they did equalise and looked to have scored shortly before that, but on the whole their finishing was abysmal. Our work rate and constant harrying and hassling however did not make it easy for them.
As for the Pro Star Arena, I have to say I was impressed. Whilst it has none of the atmosphere of Gay Meadow and is distinctly lacking in character, the facilities are good and it's easy to see how a ground in a location like that could enable Shrewsbury to host football at a higher level than League 2.
|
|
Dave
TFF member
Posts: 13,081
|
Post by Dave on Nov 15, 2009 12:31:47 GMT
So how is my post stating that I would have preferred to see Benyon up front rather than Thomson who does not strike me at all as a centre forward,anti the manager. I can only speak on what I have seen of the players, and that is only a very limited view of Thomson. Its actually my opinion that Benyon and Sills are our best partnership. That was not the view I took myself and your views were ones I shared. I have expressed my views many times on here with the failings I feel Buckle has and have even been accused of having an agenda against him. But at this time I still feel he should be supported, but like any manager before him, my views can change and results will play a big part in my future views on him as our manager. We can only ever post what we feel, or how we see things and thankfully they will never always be the same, how boring that would be. |
|
|
|
Post by Swanny on Nov 15, 2009 13:01:40 GMT
P.S. Big question of the week, where has your "R" gone, Dave ? What a question I have longed for so long to be seen only as a fellow member on the forum, but that has not always been possible even more so when I was also moderating the forum. Now that Jim does that job and believe me even its my wish a post was edited or deleted, if Jim says it should stay as it is then it will, Its no good asking someone to do a job for you then overriding them. Mine is the only account that can't be moved into any other group, I can't lose the admin tag even if I want to, by being just Dave that is how I hope everyone will see me. Well thats what I thought anyway  Thanks for explaining that, Dave, I can see where you're coming from |
|
Jon
Admin
Posts: 6,912
|
Post by Jon on Nov 15, 2009 13:13:26 GMT
Bucks opted to place Stevens and Carlisle on the flanks with a central midfield of Hargreaves and Thompson. Sills played up front, with Jake Thomson playing a less advanced position behind Sills. The logic behind Buckle's thinking appeared sound. I'm with Lambeth on this one. In many ways both Benyon and Rendell were unfortunate to be left out, but the 4-4-1-1 formation has consistently been the most effective formation when playing away against decent teams. I'm pretty sure that if Wroe had been fit, we would have seen ThomPson in the free role behind Sills, Thomson out wide and Stevens on the bench. With Wroe out, the formation made sense. Does the fact that Benyon replaced Stevens at half time, with Thomson moving out to the wing show that Buckle had made a mistake? Not at all. It appears that we played the first half into a strong wind, which made the 4-4-1-1 formation even more sensible. Having held on to 0-0 against the wind, would it not make sense to be a little more adventurous with the wind behind us and go for all three points? Benyon joining Sills up front makes absolute sense in that case, with a choice between taking off Stevens or Thomson - I would agree with taking off the former. Reading Lambeth's comments about Benyon holding the ball up well confirms what I have seen with my own eyes - the tremendous improvement Benyon has made to his all-round game over the past year or so. When we were forced to go to 4-4-1, I did wonder whether Benyon would be sacrificed even though he had not been on for long. A year ago, I think Benyon might well have been taken off as a tired Sills would have done a better job of holding up the ball than a fresh Benyon. It's good to see that Buckle was able to trust Benyon to carry out that role. |
|
merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
|
Post by merse on Nov 15, 2009 14:22:42 GMT
Does the fact that Benyon replaced Stevens at half time, with Thomson moving out to the wing show that Buckle had made a mistake? Not at all.  Well, if like you and I we make observations assuming the manager does indeed know what he is doing, does indeed place balance as the priority in selecting a side, and does indeed make his substitutions apertaining to the state of the game as it procedes; then we allow him the respect that we appreciate he is merely doing his job. If, however; one approaches every selection, every match and every result with the built in belief we know what we would do and hence that is what the manager should be doing; then we constantly go down the track of endless criticism and chipping away at the guy's professional credibilty.......................such people in my view are delusionary. |
|
|
|
Post by stewart on Nov 15, 2009 17:01:39 GMT
This is a good run of resilient performances and results, yet the one outstanding worry I have is how few goals our forwards are scoring.
I'm not saying for one moment that any of them are playing badly, but our leading scorer in the League, with a third of the season gone, has only 4 goals.
The defence and midfield seem to have settled to their tasks now and the balance is just about right, however I do feel that we desperately need to sign an experienced goalscorer and I am hoping that this is a requirement which remains uppermost in the manager's mind.
The current set are just not cutting it.
|
|
|
|
Post by davepougher on Nov 15, 2009 18:49:54 GMT
Thought long and hard about what I might say during my daughter’s 80 mile round trip away match today and ended up arguing with my own ideas and thoughts. If I had to sum up the whole match day experience in one word, weird.
Ordered my four match day tickets at reduced price on Thurs. no problem at all. Drove to the ground even, sourced my parking with a far too complicated story to bore you with, lovely stadium; I thought from the outside collected the tickets and started to proceed in. Upon sitting down the stadium announcer who clearly liked the sound of his own voice, spoke about anything and everything at ear piercing volume bordering on the unbearable. I caught the attention of a chap in the security box and pointed to the PA speaker and gestured for him to turn it down. He clearly had no control of such things. On the way out I asked a steward why the PA system was louder in the away end. Not knowing that it was just testing him out. His reply was “I don’t know but it always is”. Why would they do that? You tell me. It baffles me that the same respect laws that were toughened this season bar me from standing behind the goal when my daughter plays keeper are allowed play load music when a home team scores and do things like the above. Or am I finally realising that I’m getting old? Everything a good stadium should have but missing its personallity.
On to the game. There have been some excellent match reports so I won’t compete with them at this late hour I’ll just pass on my thoughts. A few have questioned the Thomson, Sills combination. When I first saw them line up this way I have to say I was pleased as I saw it as a possible answer to the lack of pace for Sills. Not sure if that’s what PB was thinking but he tried it and it didn’t work out. No problem with that what so ever. The match it’s self was almost surreal at times they seemed to have a bit more skill than ourselves but didn’t want to work as hard and as the game wore on and I really did fancy us to win, up until the sending off, at that point I’d have gladly paid for a point but left feeling slightly miffed. Not sure, having watched it again, it was a straight red offence their player seemed to do the same as Charnock. Their falling to the ground every time the ball lost was frustrating at times but it was clearly in their game plan as were their team reactions to our offences which I find very disappointing. We definitely missed Wroe who I hope recovers quickly, he’s one of these players that you don’t realise what he does until he’s not there. Hargreaves was my MOM without a doubt not because he scored but because he was doing everything a good captain should. Just how long can we keep relying on him? A draw was I suppose a fair result in the end on reflection but we still are seeking that little bit of invention that will change our season and placing to one more like Shrewsbury’s as they certainly aren’t any better than us despite what the league says.
|
|
Dave
TFF member
Posts: 13,081
|
Post by Dave on Nov 15, 2009 19:18:13 GMT
Thanks for a great report Dave, the next time you are planning an away game and its raining, you just PM me again, I'm happy to sit by the radio and check if the match is still on, in return for well written posts like yours.
|
|
merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
|
Post by merse on Nov 15, 2009 19:23:47 GMT
You would think that an new out of town stadium with an enourmous car park would present absolutely no problems in parking. But you're not allowed in the club car park without a permit. There isn't anyway to park over the road. Percy Thrower doesn't allow you to park in his Garden Center even though he's been dead since 1988 and dour Duncan Bannatyne doesn't like you parking in his Leisure Centre. So the options are to park in the Hotel for a fiver or in the Car Rental place for a fiver. Most of the streets I saw had "no match day parking" signs warning you not to even try. Not good enough in my book. After 2 and a half hours driving in gale force wind and rain you want to park as quickly as possible. This rapidly escalating disrespect of football fans is one of the worst aspect of present day football in my opinion and one of the reasons I am becoming too arsed to bother going to many grounds. Most of you know I live within a spit of Arsenal and I wouldn't dream of making a fuss about matchday congestion, yet when the Emirates was built it was with a "public transport" label that together with the 2km CPZ (contolled parking zone) set up around the ground; the local council (as only local council's would) imagined would keep cars away and force everyone onto the Tube or bus. Well it has except for the filthy rich who now happily pay upwards of £500 a season for parking in a series of school playgrounds, business service yards and any other little piece of space that can be utilised for profit. My kids school accomodates 40 cars per match at £500 each per season....................you work it out and you multiply that by a couple of hundred local establishments and think whether or not the locals mind a 60,000 capacity stadium in their midst. Yet there are some ~ and surprise suprise it's the local Yuppies and Tarquins who bought up all the "desirable" property on the cheap and sell it for near millions on the doorstep of one of the world's leading football clubs who had been here since 1909. The same oiks who complained about "rowdy" Arsenal fans (rowdy Gooners? there's no such animal in the Kingdom of God ~ sleepy more like) packing the pubs and eating chips in the street. The same idiots who tried to block the building of an indoor sports centre to compliment the fantastic stadium that the Emirates is. The same wnackers who deride adjoining Finsbury Park and Holloway as "devaluing " their precious Highbury "village". Bear all this in mind when promoting the re-location of OUR football club to some middle class dormitory like Clennon Valley folks because this is just the sort of shit you would have to put up with. I've been busy updating The Jelly's Diary today......................take a peek and keep it schtumm |
|
|
|
Post by chrish on Nov 15, 2009 23:26:03 GMT
I completely forgot about the prat on the Shrewsbury Town PA. He reminded me a little of Squadron Leader Numpty working the PA at Woking last season. We had a something similar at the rugby today. It's not needed.
|
|
merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
|
Post by merse on Nov 16, 2009 16:26:11 GMT
Only a TV highlights view of proceedings but: That tackle by Charnock, whilst poorly executed (when you're on your arse you're out of the game) but in no way was it worthy of anything more than a free kick and a bit of advice to "keep it tidy" Granted, both feet were off the ground, but that is NOT a two footed tackle as has been alleged...................and as for "showing studs" ~ what's the lad supposed to do, turn his ankle so that he risks breaking it?  If the ref does word his report to that effect, Charnock's dismissal must be overturned surely. Another ref who hasn't a clue about the mechanics of executing a tackle. I'm not in agreement with the crticism I saw somewhere of Ellis in the conceding of the goal either........................somewhat an "armchair" critic's opinion if you ask me and the player did all that he was able to do taking in consideration the proximity of opponents to clear the danger, just that he wasn't successful...........that's no error!
|
|
|
|
Post by aussie on Nov 16, 2009 18:15:07 GMT
That tackle by Charnock, whilst poorly executed (when you're on your arse you're out of the game) but in no way was it worthy of anything more than a free kick and a bit of advice to "keep it tidy" Granted, both feet were off the ground, but that is NOT a two footed tackle as has been alleged...................and as for "showing studs" ~ what's the lad supposed to do, turn his ankle so that he risks breaking it? If the ref does word his report to that effect, Charnock's dismissal must be overturned surely. Another ref who hasn't a clue about the mechanics of executing a tackle. This is why a lot of people argue the point of good ref`s are usually ex players! |
|
midlandstufc
TFF member
Posts: 945
Favourite Player: Dawkins lol
|
Post by midlandstufc on Nov 16, 2009 19:48:05 GMT
Many fair points from the earlier match reports.
Personally I think the Charnock sending off was right in the current interpretations of the laws. We'd have been well cheesed off if it was on the other foot and not been given. Having said that however, it nearly was on the other foot and it split second the other way and the Shrews player would have walked. I went for a drink and a very long walk (nod to earlier posts on the very large no go area around the ground) to the game with a colleague who's a season ticket holder and he was of the same opinion.
Was very windy and in the first half you couldn't tell by the way we played; it was like we were the home team. Then their wingers got in to it and we were under the cosh - it just seemed that they didn't want it as much or they were well low on confidence.
I liked Thomson starting with Sills up front but he just didn't get the rub of the green.
Would have took Sills off rather than Thomson but I suppose Sills' experience was the decider.
Benyon did fight well and his control is improving.
Our goal was lucky as their defence was asleep but then ours was too 6 minutes later.
Williams has absolutely no confidence but does well in containing and covering his left-back.
Carlisle was my MoM despite some poor crosses (for him) during the game. Mansell was also excellent with his workrate and composure.
Sills just not look like scoring but neither does Heskey for England.
My mate did tell me the reason for such a large stadium but I've forgotten it; but I do remember that he said they sold Gay Meadow for a fortune and the land had been resold twice since, each time for less!
All in all a game you would expect at our level and we actually looked that we should be at this level. Home form will be key in the run up to January and support like the 310 gave surely would help the team greatly!
I think I've thawed out now but how do our young fans in just their Torquay tops do it? Loads of beer or vaseline-covered bodies (ooer, I think I've just come over all Stephen Fry ... ooer again!).
|
|
If the ref does word his report to that effect, Charnock's dismissal must be overturned surely.