mike
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Posts: 158
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Post by mike on Feb 25, 2012 17:05:35 GMT
2-0, oastler off. Oh dear, oh dear. New faces needed this week...there isn't the strength in depth and the players who have been playing week in week out need some help! Clearly the squad isn't good enough What has happened to Leadbitter or whatever he is called and if Macklin isn't good enough for the first team why is he still here? |
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rjdgull
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Post by rjdgull on Feb 25, 2012 18:03:08 GMT
Only three shots on target and I think we are missing Bodin big time. No need to panic and we are still there or there abouts but another forward thinking player is desparately needed now.
Losing Oastler is a big loss. Will Leadbitter have his first start against Crawley away?
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Post by loyalgull on Feb 25, 2012 18:42:02 GMT
horrible feeling this would be a loss,gillingham 1 point in eight,then we come along,so typical us,very frustrating and very disappointing.We need bodies in pronto,with a bit of quality,shake them up,tiredness is not an excuse either,its the same for all teams,sort it out lingy please
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Feb 25, 2012 18:45:26 GMT
For the first time in a long while I didn't hear the match and long to read a match report from those present. 3 shots in 90 minutes is poor and cause for conern. Difficult to comment without being called defeatist or whatever the right word is. Tuesdays match against Buckland proved (only 1 match) that we don't have the youth ready. We have missed a full time replacement for Kee, well since he left. I've thought (and others) that the squad is Fred Bare without quality on the bench. I think Lingy needs to go out and find a head covering tool and a visit to a butchers/pet shop wouldn't go a miss either - easy to say from the comfort of the 1806 from Paddington. Was Oastler straight red or two yellows? Still, we wouldn't have been happy in League 1 would we  |
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Post by triggersbroom on Feb 25, 2012 19:04:16 GMT
Gills fan here; Oastler was a straight red but I imagine you will appeal it. The ref got the wrong man. I don't know the name of the guy that committed the foul but he was considerably erm, duskier than Oastler  |
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JamesB
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Post by JamesB on Feb 25, 2012 19:13:33 GMT
Let's not jump to conclusions. There's no point crawling out of the woodwork saying "we haven't got the strength in depth", "we haven't replaced Kee", or "we haven't done this or that" now. No one was saying that when we were winning
The problem is not depth or anything like that. It's confidence. I had worried that we might have peaked too soon - our run couldn't go on forever, and it tends to be that once you get beaten once, you get beaten a couple of times. I just hope it doesn't spiral out of control as it did in 98, because the risk is we might not make the play-offs
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Feb 25, 2012 19:38:50 GMT
Let's not jump to conclusions. There's no point crawling out of the woodwork saying "we haven't got the strength in depth", "we haven't replaced Kee", or "we haven't done this or that" now. No one was saying that when we were winning The problem is not depth or anything like that. It's confidence. I had worried that we might have peaked too soon - our run couldn't go on forever, and it tends to be that once you get beaten once, you get beaten a couple of times. I just hope it doesn't spiral out of control as it did in 98, because the risk is we might not make the play-offs Woodfeckinwork - I for one have been worried about replacing Kee for weeks - I'm sure it's on here somewhere. Anyone who thinks the squad has depth to change games must be looking at a different team. We ground out results in our winning run - I still don't know how we beat Swindon ( scoring one more than them helped). Yes we are now better and holding on to leads - well when we have them! Lingy is aware of the dangers of the loan market - Stanley last year and Bodin this year. A happy medium is needed between the amount of loan players Buckle has bought in Lingy. Is Bodin the only one to actually play a first team game? We have had nothing on the bench in months that could change games - not IMO a confidence thing. Idealy Kees FT replacement plus A.N.Other - can't see that breaking the bank. Who's next up - Crawley?  |
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Post by bristolgull on Feb 25, 2012 20:19:44 GMT
When I talk of lacking strength in depth I certainly don't mean to take away from the excellent job the players and manager have done this season, far outstripping expectations. We are still in with a good chance of the play offs and two losses doesn't negate our previous excellent run. However in my opinion we have a great starting 11 but beyond that there isn't currently the scope to change things if things are going well in a match, that's why we need another couple of players. It's certainly not doom and gloom, its a fact that you can't really rely on 11
Or 12 players for an entire season as there is gonna be injuries and off days to contend with, that's when you need to be able to bring adequate replacements...something I don't feel we can quite do with the current squad...
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Post by register on Feb 25, 2012 20:55:56 GMT
I can see why Lingy felt the need to watch Gillingham last night as only Whelpdale, Weston and Kuffour started both in this and our previous game together!  Whether this is the reason that they are on a poor run at the moment is debatable but one point from six games is unacceptable for this club despite some tough fixtures in there. Although it could be a good time to play them, they were on a bad run last time we met and history could repeat itself as we had also just lost to a lowly Bradford side previously. Looking at the Gillingham side, it is nice to see that Rooney and Nouble won't be featuring although the attack is all ex Torquay with Tomlin and Kuffour both doing well here and the defence will have to be top drawer to frustrate them! Oliver Lee has been drafted in on loan to beef up their side but appears to be starting on the bench. Four of the substitutes from the October match, started on Tuesday including the keeper but not sure how significant this is as their strength in depth will be much greater than ours! Their last win was at home on 2nd Jan with a 1-0 win against Aldershot. The news today seems to be that Lathope is targeting to be fit for the Crawley match and this away trip comes too soon for him so I would imagine that McPhee will continue as his deputy unless Lingy dips into the loan market before this match but suspect it will be after. The only other issue is Atieno or Howe up front and personally I would like to see Rene start, if only to try and regain his form and fitness pre Christmas as we need his goals! The previous Gillingham match thread is quite a good read as it was quite interesting to see the comments made as we hit the nadir of our fortunes at home with much comment about our leaking defence which to be fair, aprt from Lathrope was turned round by the reintroduction of Mark Ellis and Oastler finding his feet in this position. If we score two again, I now fancy us to win this one.  We had also switched back to 4-4-2 from 4-3-3 previously which proves that the right system doesn't always work! I don't think it matters whether Atieno or Howe plays, it's doubtfull if either will score! What might be interesting though is to play them together for a few games, think we might get a few goals that way. As for the match tomorrow, don't see us getting anything out of it sadly! Well, I got my wish, our strike force actually got to play together...and still they can't score! In their defence though, I don't think we adopted a 4:4:2 formation when Atenio came on. New striker needed...............................really looking forward to Crawley next week! |
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petef
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Post by petef on Feb 25, 2012 22:17:45 GMT
The realists amongst us knew it was only a matter of time before we got out found out.
This is no distraction to the fantastic achievement of points gained successive wins etc.
You cannot continually ship players, Kee, Robertson, lose quality in the squad, not strengthen and hope to be consistently competitive and seriously mix it with the big boys.
Yes it has had the desired effect of getting wages and costs down but to me it also emphasises that the club are not to concerned about really going for promotion this season.
Its not a problem for me, though I think it would be for some, as I think we would suffer big time if we did happen to go up. Lets face it as a club we only just manage to compete at this level and thankfully we have some very good pros at the club with a a bit of ability and determination to succeed.
Taking this current philosophy of running a squad on empty into the league above would, my opinion be a recipe for disaster. If in the future we are lucky enough to be in a position to be able to compete in league one all well and good but I just don't want to see another half cocked and uncommitted attempt at survival we all witnessed under Leroy, and we all know that happened on that last day accident at Southend and that Milke Bateson had his head in his hands wondering how he could finance it.
Lingy has done brilliantly to get us up there and amongst it but if we want to sustain it he must commit funds to squad strengthening as the backup we all hoped would shine through well it just hasn't happened has it?. We have been exceptionally lucky with injuries and have not suffered to badly with suspensions. Single goal wins when we have had to really defend to protect a lead has not convinced me we are good enough to get promoted. As well as the system has worked we are simply to one dimensional with far to few attacking options, to sign someone who can give us that option and just look how Wycombe did today by brining in Paul Hayes and Garry Doherty. We need similar if its going to happen for us this season and I think we are well on the way to looking a "gift horse in the mouth".
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Post by crooky on Feb 25, 2012 22:27:53 GMT
I was at the game today and thought were pretty poor to be honest. Appeared to be a yard off the pace. Maybe with such a small squad and lack of options I think we may well be looking a little jaded.
Definitely need to strengthen our attacking options. An injection of pace is a definite requirement.
We are obviously suffering from a worrying lack of goals scored in recent games and can't rely on on a water tight defence forever. Seem to be getting deeper and deeper until we ultimately concede and are forced into a more attacking line up. All rather frustrating.
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JamesB
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Post by JamesB on Feb 26, 2012 0:28:15 GMT
Jesus, the way you lot are talking, you wouldn't think we've just come off the back of 7 wins in a row
Realistically, we knew the run was going to end, of course, but if we want to be realistic, we should also be aware that the same set of players that lost today are the same set of players that got us the 7 wins in a row. Strengthening is irrelevant - it's a confidence issue, with it having taken a hit after losing for the first time in such a long period, and an issue of being found out, as all teams are eventually. And there's not an awful lot you can do to change that, including throwing money at bringing in players overnight because we lost a couple of games (and we don't have the money to do that anyway). Football doesn't work like that
Yes, we do need another back-up player or two, but the only thing you'll guarantee by ditching Atieno and Howe for a new striker, or Morris or Stevens for a new winger, in the middle of a promotion push, is that you'll knock their confidence even further, and disrupt the harmony of the squad. There's no guarantee you'll get results out of it - in fact, I would suggest knee-jerk changes right now would be a negative. Ideally we need to get back to winning ways before bringing someone in, otherwise we'll never get back to winning. When we went on our terrible run in 97/98, Hodges kept the faith, didn't add new players to the first XI, and we got within a game of going up anyway
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Feb 26, 2012 7:54:48 GMT
Jesus, the way you lot are talking, you wouldn't think we've just come off the back of 7 wins in a row Yes it’s hard to believe our team had prior to the last two defeats won seven games on the trot. If we are all honest here, those seven wins were never really expected and when you consider the size of the squad Martin Ling has operated with, those wins were a remarkable achievement. It’s always the case that any good run that sees any team move near the top of the table gets fans expectations way to high and as soon as the team lose a game or two, what went before soon gets forgotten. It’s only natural that any fan of a football club wants to see its team win and gain promotion as it is wining teams that will keep the fans coming through the turnstiles and slowly one would hope, start getting the drifters and lost fans back. We had had many debates on here about the merits of promotion for a club our size and one that has to operate in very difficult circumstances due to the fact it’s not located in a town that is football mad. Low gates and all the extra costs that come with a club located where it is, make just keeping the club afloat such a real challenge and being able to have a very completive team even more difficult. I always feel one need’s to look at the whole picture and when you look where we still are in the table, the fact we have a new grandstand being built and for the first time in a long time the club made a trading profit, things are very good indeed for Torquay United and its fans. I can’t comment on the players as due to a number of reasons I have not seen them play much this season, yes reading all your views it does seem the squad is rather thin and its back to the days when the best eleven players are out on the pitch, we have a very weak bench and no match winners as such we can bring on to change the game in our favour. Buckles way would have been to get rid of players this time of year and bring in a good number of loan players, is that what fans want Martin Ling to do? Or do we as James have said, keep faith with the players we have and maybe just look to bring in one or two to help give the side a bit more depth. I have always felt where possible the team that started the season should be the team that finishes it, I have hated the seasons when halfway through it players were cast aside and loan players brought in who would only be around for a few months if that. That’s not any way to build a squad and in Buckles case was just a way to try and buy him wins so he could fulfil his own personal ambitions and we all know what happened to him in the end. With the size of our gates and a well run club doing all it can to live within its means and not go down the road of so many others clubs if we were just above the drop zone that might be seen as a good achievement. To be where we are in the table and the good season we are having so far is nothing short of a miracle and we should only being heaping praise on the players and the club. Yes I can hear you now all saying is this words from a man who seemed very anti club at the beginning of the season? The facts were I was in a bad place back then and got angry for good reason about the lack of any basic communication as far as the TFF programme pages being pulled where concerned and the mad affair about just trying to get into the Gulls Nest to give money for the walk for Carol to Lou. Looking in now from the outside has made me realise just what a good job the club on the whole is doing and just how well Martin Ling has done having to operate with such a small squad. It used to be the joke for years that Torquay United would always do well up until Christmas and then fall away in the second half of the season, I think those days have gone and since the day we lost our league all Torquay United fans should only feel proud of what their little seaside football club has achieved. We may not have the best players in the league, but I do believe for the first time in a while due only to Martin Ling, we have a great sprit in the dressing room and I’m sure that fact alone will see the team back to winning ways sooner rather than later. Yes there is a need maybe to add a bit to the squad as there are still many games to play and with such a thin squad you only need an injury or two or a few suspensions to find the odds heavily stacked against the team to get any sort of result out on the pitch. Keep the faith and please don’t forget that seven winning game run, even Buckle with the way he operated had a number of bad losing runs when he was here and yet the team for what ever reason turned things around and got back to winning ways and I’m sure that will be the case again. |
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Post by register on Feb 26, 2012 7:57:43 GMT
Jesus, the way you lot are talking, you wouldn't think we've just come off the back of 7 wins in a row Realistically, we knew the run was going to end, of course, but if we want to be realistic, we should also be aware that the same set of players that lost today are the same set of players that got us the 7 wins in a row. Strengthening is irrelevant - it's a confidence issue, with it having taken a hit after losing for the first time in such a long period, and an issue of being found out, as all teams are eventually. And there's not an awful lot you can do to change that, including throwing money at bringing in players overnight because we lost a couple of games (and we don't have the money to do that anyway). Football doesn't work like that Yes, we do need another back-up player or two, but the only thing you'll guarantee by ditching Atieno and Howe for a new striker, or Morris or Stevens for a new winger, in the middle of a promotion push, is that you'll knock their confidence even further, and disrupt the harmony of the squad. There's no guarantee you'll get results out of it - in fact, I would suggest knee-jerk changes right now would be a negative. Ideally we need to get back to winning ways before bringing someone in, otherwise we'll never get back to winning. When we went on our terrible run in 97/98, Hodges kept the faith, didn't add new players to the first XI, and we got within a game of going up anywayIf we don't introduce someone into our side who can score goals, I think history is about to repeat itself! |
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Feb 26, 2012 9:21:47 GMT
I was at the game today and thought were pretty poor to be honest. Appeared to be a yard off the pace. Maybe with such a small squad and lack of options I think we may well be looking a little jaded. Definitely need to strengthen our attacking options. An injection of pace is a definite requirement. We are obviously suffering from a worrying lack of goals scored in recent games and can't rely on on a water tight defence forever. Seem to be getting deeper and deeper until we ultimately concede and are forced into a more attacking line up. All rather frustrating. I don't know Crooky, two defeats this season and the knives are out for him. Apparently its not the depth or quality of the squad but confidence. Go and stand on the naughty step!  |
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Whether this is the reason that they are on a poor run at the moment is debatable but one point from six games is unacceptable for this club despite some tough fixtures in there. Although it could be a good time to play them, they were on a bad run last time we met and history could repeat itself as we had also just lost to a lowly Bradford side previously.
We had also switched back to 4-4-2 from 4-3-3 previously which proves that the right system doesn't always work! 